22 November 2008

I abhor their views but we cannot ban them

It turns my stomach to think of racist police, soldiers and prison officers discriminating against people (why only these professions have bans when others do not?). If they compromise their jobs they should lose their jobs. BUT it is possible to be racist and not to be prejudiced to carry out a job in a reasonable manner - it is possible. And for that reason we should not ostracise BNP members - they are idiots but they have to be allowed to live their lives - it is a simple matter of freedom of speech - end of.


  1. Quite right, Neil: well said.


  2. I agree Neil.

    If people discriminate illegally at work, all employers have disciplinary procedures that can be used to punish them.

    If you kep your views to yourself and do your job as required there can be no grounds for dismissal.

    People should be rewarded and punished for what they do, not for what they think.

  3. In the spirit of rewarding and punishing, ala Steve, let's reward those who support their country against foreign invaders, such as MUSLIMS, and punish those who opened the floodgates to them.

    We also need to get rid of all those unwanted foreign invading MUSLIMS, and who better than the BNP to handle the job?

    You abhor their views, eh? Golly, so good of you, no, so very SWEET of you to not think they should lose their jobs for belonging to a patriotic organization or for expressing racism. How beneficent and magnanimous of you.

    Of course, you wouldn't dream of firing a MUSLIM for marching against England and promising to convert you to Islam or kill you trying. Because that would be wrong. Right?

    Oh, I'm sorry. Did I interrupt your milk and toast?

  4. Rastaman: I don't understand the point you are trying to make. Can you explain?

  5. George Miller29/11/08 1:38 pm

    Rastaman is pointing out an infuriating double standard: if you’re a British person who criticizes a Jihadist then you’re a “racist” and everybody is obliged to say they hate you (abhor your views, etc) whereas if you’re a Muslim saying that a non-Muslim is a filthy Kafir no more worthy of respect than a pig rolling around in its own excrement than nobody is allowed to criticize you (lest they be called racist).

    Patriotic Brit = racist
    Islamic extremist = victim

  6. GM: I think you are wrong - the Daily Mail, Express, Telegraph, Sun, Star and most local press make this same point for you everyday.

    It is you who has got to wake up. To claim white male middle class people are the real victims when the evidence is that they get all the best jobs, get lesser sentences even when they are convicted (which is rare) and have better treatment by the NHS and public services in general - it is pathetic. You are living in a Daily Mail world that is just not reflected in reality.

  7. Neil, it is not a political straight-jacket that constrains your views, but a psychological one.

    It is irrational to suggest that law-abiding white middle class people should be treated less favourably than criminals from other classes, age groups and ethnicities.

    Your guilt has narrowed your mind to the point of insanity.

    Deep breath...

  8. Cheapside - I suggested no such thing! It is your paper the Daily Mail that wants middle class people to be let off littering, speeding and tax dodging. It is your lot that wants to be treated favourably (and you are blind to the fact you already are treated more favourably).

  9. George Miller: "if you’re a British person who criticizes a Jihadist then you’re a “racist” and everybody is obliged to say they hate you"

    What an absurd and surreal comment.

    The media is full of condemnation of Islamic fundamentalists. Newspapers go to town on the likes of Abu Hamza. Channel 4 screens programs like 'Undercover Mosque'. Big-name newspaper commentators like the brothers Hitchens, Melanie Phillips, Nick Cohen, Richard Littlejohn criticise them. Writers like Martin Amis and Ian McEwan criticise them.

    Are you so stupid as to actually believe this victim status drivel you're coming out with?

  10. But the thing is "my" paper isn't the Daily Mail. Why did you presume it was?

    Where did you get the idea that I wanted anyone let off with any crime?

    Who are "my lot"? You don't know me. Am I a middle class property owner from a 2 parent family? Or brought up by one in a coucil house? Does it matter?

    Why do you presume I have been treated more favourably?

    My comment was against the presumption that "law-abiding" people from one age / ethnic group should be treated less favourably than criminals from another.

    How could there possibly be an argument aganinst that - this side of sanity?

  11. cheapside: You are unlikely to believe such a preposterous thing as 'white middle class people are discriminated against' in a society that actually quite clearly does the opposite, unless you are influenced by /Mail/Express/Telegraph propaganda and probably white and middle class - that is the only reason such a thing would matter.

  12. Neil Harding, my last entry can only have been about 100 words, yet you manifestly failed to read them. I did at no time say taht "white middle class people are discriminated against." You did.

    What you did instead of reading what I wrote to is infer that anyone who disagrees with you must be a fascist.

    In other words, anyone who is not like you must be ridiculed and abused. That's called bigotry in my book.

    Mr Harding, you are a bigot.

    Also, you got it wrong on all the papers again. Let's put you out of your misery (and what a misery you are). I only buy on Saturdays and Sundays: Independent or Gruaniad and Indie or Observer.

    I do do caffs though, so whatever tabloid happens to be left behind ("ha!" shreiks the desperate Mr H, "gotcha. So now I can hate-cha!")

  13. I stand corrected on the papers you read - but you still state that white middle class people are being discriminated against - this is complete hogwash. You may not read or buy the Mail/Sun/Express/Metro etc but you are obviously influenced by its propaganda.

  14. This really is annoying.

    I have NEVER said that middle class people are discriminated against.

    Can't your read?

  15. CS: Look we both claim that everyone should be treated equally. The difference is I believe the lower the socio-economic class the harsher the treatment they get - the evidence bears this out. They receive harsher sentences for the same crimes, higher conviction rates, lower educational and career opportunities. Whereas you imply (even if you deny it) that it is white middle class people who are hard done by - there is no evidence for this - just daily tabloid rhetoric, which has obviously corroded your brain (and millions of others). You accuse me of being irrational and wanting to 'oppress' the middle class. I find that claim more than ridiculous. Even if what you claim were true - which is worse, favouring the rich and powerful or favouring the poor and defenceless?

  16. The problem is that you are a bigot who can't read.